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[B]The Sample Home Detox (w/OTC WD Coping Options)[/B] has been established by the Moderator as a sticky post and can be found as the top "sticky post" at the top of each list. [B]

Following are the various discussions regarding it and detox in general.

[U]My personal experience with the OTC Coping Options List:[/U]
3 times----first with Vicodin, Xanax, and then Tramadol. It has been a year since I last detoxed. And, I am having surgery again in a month and came to the Boards to find information on managing post-surgery concerns. Several people were on the same board in the middle of detox and on bridge of aborting so I went digging for all my personal journal notes on how I did the home detox. It is a compilation of home detox suggestions from various people on various boards, and as written represents my own personal detox plan. I thought I would post it here to help others. I was sooooooo greatful to find OTC relief to help me get through it that I wanted to give thanks by giving back to others. The more that we can help others get off this crap the better. It is a horrible demon to have on your back-----as we all know, you transition from painfree euphoria to an imprisoned Vicodin haze that blunts and controls everything in your life where nothing else begins to matter except counting and splitting pills to get to your next RX date:(

For me, each time I used almost everything on the list. The only thing I didn't need was the Immodium; never had the runs that most that shows that everyone will not experience WDs exactly the same, but there are universal things as stated on the list. For me the Xanax and the Tramadol detox was far worse and longer than the Vicodin. Though let there be no doubt that Vicodin is difficult as evidenced by the fact that so many end up having to professionally detox to be successful. However, with this list and self-dertermination folks can do it. The worst of the Vicodin detox is usually days 2-4 for most people where you are definitely not functioning well, and not sleeping hardly at all. After Day 4 things start stabilizing where you can at least sleep some and that helps. I definitely was not able to work during that time. As to what works, everything on the list collectively helps. For what works best, if I had to single any one thing out I would have to say hot baths. Almost always when I was absolutely at the end of my rope I would run a bubble bath of water as HOT as I could stand it as that would settle nerves and leg twitches, but only temporarily. For the first 4 days I probably took somewhere between 6-10 HOT baths a day. Next, would be the hot rice socks to settle the same symptoms whenever I was too waterlogged or exhausted to get in the tub. It is really hard to single any one thing out though. For example, sleep deprivation is horrible and all the things that helped induce sleep also helps. But then there is the 20-30 min day exercise----sooooooooo critical to get that body working for YOU takes 20-30 min a day to get your endorphins jumpstarted and producing natural dopamine. When that kicks in the WD joint pain subsides considerably. Now, I can tell you that the Zinc/Magnesium part of the formula is a recent addition, and that was not part of my original formula, but based on the experience of others it seems extremely critical. Every last one of the people that added it, and they were in the middle detox, felt some relief right away and said the relief built everyday. From their experience we concluded that if you were to start the Zinc/Mag 1-2 weeks in advance and build up that it would make a major difference. It not only helps w/WD pain and depression, but folks after detox stated it helped them with pain management since they were no longer on RX pain meds.

When I did my detoxes I researched and prepared well for it as I was terrified to detox at home, but there was no way I was going through the open humilation of professional detox center. I am sure I spent over $200 for everything I bought to do the detox. Sounds like a lot, but pales in comparison to what I had been spending for years on, I reconciled it with myself that it was my insurance policy to ensure success of ridding myself of that tether to a pillbottle.

As to percentage, I have not detoxed without using the formula so its really hard to say on that. I have no doubt though that without the formula, for me personally I am not sure that I would have made it through the Xanax or Tramadol detox without it. I would have likely made it on the Vicodin detox but I think it would have been twice as bad. I can tell you the most recent gal to do it, just got her Vicodin RX for 120 pills filled last Wed and by the following Tues she had only 1 pill left. She was forced into this because no more pills....cold turkey from 120 pills in one week type habit to 0, OUCH. I gave her the list to help as she was terrified as to what to expect and could not tell her husband what she had done. Well, today is Day 3 cold turkey for her which is usually one of the worst days, and she remarkably states she feels pretty good and thusfar is having minimal WDs---pretty phenominal, but things could be delayed...who knows, bless her heart. I know the principal thing from the list of what she is using that she seems to be crediting the difference to is the Zinc/Mag (must be taken w/food or it will make you sick). I know that she is also using Immodium and other things from the list to help, but she has not yet specified exactly what things. She was thrust into detox with no planning so no time to plan and shop in advance so she is having to use things that she already had at home, and fortunately she had Zinc, Immodium, and a few others. I will ask her specifically what she has.

Once you cut that pillbottle tether rope, the rope wraps tightly around the pole for a few days while in WDs, but then it loosens, lets go, and hangs straight giving you control of YOUR life back....FREEDOM. It is a wonderful feeling to be a full functioning memeber of my family again and not thinking of pills the first thing when I wake up in the morning. Anyway, hope I have answered your questions; am happy to help.
Luvn, you are quite welcome. Its great that you are doing a taper. It is very hard I know....we have all been on some form of taper at some point if nothing more than splitting pills to make them last between RX I understand what you are going through is a real challenge, but good for you in your determination!! Focus on how great you are going to feel when it is over!!! Start building up your body nutrient base now w/good multi-vitamin and a multi-mineral, add additional C & E as they are excellent anti-oxidants. Most multi-vitamins have some minerals in them but you will need an additional broad spectrum multi-mineral supplement, plus extras of some particular vitamins; most importantly the Zinc, B-Complex pillform and B-Complex Sublingual Liquid Drops. The reason for both pillform and drops in the B-Complex is the pillform has higher levels of all the Bs except B-12 which is pointless to put in pillform because the body can not absorb it very well from pillform. B-12 is vital for energy and the central nervous system, but the body can only absorb it from natural dietary sources, injectable form, or sublingual liquid form under the tongue. The B-Complex sublingual w/B-12 has an elevated amount of B-12 w/very low amounts of the other B-Vitamins so it works well in harmony together.

Substance abuse in any form substantially robs the body of vital nutrients. For example, something we can all relate to as well is alchohol hangovers. Almost everyone has had one at one time or another in their life where the next morning you have the jittery shakes and jittery nauseous stomach. That is because high alcohol intake depletes the body of Vitamin Bs. If you take a VitB-Complex, 100 mg, before you leave the house or have first drink, it will substantially mitigate the hangover feeling. It will help even more if you also drink 2-3 glasses or more of water throughout the evening. Now will that work for heavy binge drinkers? Probably not. Will it work for people who have just a little more than they should? For most, probably yes, at least you will be somewhat functional the following day and not porcelain royalty or with one foot hanging off the bed;)

Vicodin addiction is not all that different, with the exception that the chemical composition in it blunts the body's ability to feel the full force of the nutrient depletion. However, once the Vicodin is stopped, that is felt full force and whiplash WDs begin. The goal is to mitigate that effect. Building a solid nutrient base BEFORE detox substantially helps and results in a more stabilized detox with lessened WDs. Adding the nutrients only AFTER the detox WDs have started requires substantially increased supplement levels and results in rollercoaster WDs, but can be done. The greatest success and the best for your body comes from the most stabilized and sensible approach; i.e., building a solid nutrient base first and supports more reasonable supplement levels during detox.

Exercise as much as you can. For the first several minutes your body's workmen are all trying, but they all doing different things and not working in efficient harmony together. It takes 20-30 min of exercise to get them synchronized and working in efficiently. Once they get used to it, they get organized and get on the job on their own more quickly. It is the only way to get your body's own natural factory working again. You see, not only have you been trapped in a Vicodin haze for sometime now, so has your body's workmen. They have all become slackers because they weren't needed as long as you were externally providing what nature designed them to do. So, they have been on a longggggggggg coffee break for however long you have been externally supplying a different source. Once the external source stops, it sends fire alarm bells loudly clanging and the workmen have jumped up and are running around all in different directions to finding to find their gear and figure out what the hell they did with the keys to the truck!!! It will take them a few days to get back on the job efficiently for you, but they will. They are designed by nature to do it naturally. By exercising YOU get them organized and it is your body's natural process of giving them instruction on what to do for you. If you don't give the instruction/exercise, they will eventually figure it out on their own, but it will take them longer without a crew leader, YOU!
You are quite welcome. If the post only helps but 1 person then it was worth my time and effort to do it. The fear of *what* to expect from detox is horrifying, especially for first time. Just knowing what to expect and some possible coping options somehow substantially strengthens people's ability to endure detox. Otherwise what happens is when WDs start getting "the meanies", the fear factor kicks in and works on your mind---all at the same time that your body cravings are acting like a damn 2yr old pitching a fit in the floor to MAKE you give in and give it what it craves. It is a challenge to cope with it all happening simultaneously and at a time when your clarity of thought is at its worst so you aren't able to analyze and sort it out while in the midst of WDs. That is why a well plan and prepared for detox is invaluable. When the s**t starts hitting the fan, you know what it is, how long to expect it on your doorstep, which all somehow helps to find the much needed inner strength to hang in there and endure. The detox process works up to a peak, usually between days 3-4, and just when it feels it is at its absolute worse and scaring the hell out of you is when many abort detox out of fear it will get worse or just not knowing what to expect....when in fact they are unknowingly right at the peak. If they can just hang on and endure it for the next 24-48 hours, it progressivlely turns the corner and starts to stabilize. Once the body realizes that you are NOT going to give it what it craves, like the 2 yr old pitching the fit, it will get physically exhausted from the fight and let go, relinquishing control to you. You will have won, but you must immediately take charge because like the 2 yr old it is going to try and test you just to see if you were serious. Your challenge is trying to show that YOU are in charge, through exercise, at a time when you will be physically exhausted from the battle. Your legs will begin to feel so heavy that they feel like they should be on someone's body. They just don't won't to work right for you. It will feel it is impossible during this phase to exercise, but there are things that you can and MUST do to work those muscles and let your body sense that YOU are giving the instructions. It is a re-training process. Start with the muscle tightening/release exercises mentioned in the 1st post or lift free wieghts with arms to get muscles and those little endorphin workmen organized and functioning....don't let em be slackers. When you slack off, it sends a signal to your brain to look for an EXTERNAL source, and "the craving critter" will revisit you agian. After the heavy legs phase and the feeling lifts, your nerve endings will start to come to life....they aren't used to functioning efficiently so they may have periodic misfires and give you muscle twitches and restless legs...HOT BATHS...Aspercreme and Hot Rice Packs(see 1st post on instructions) will help, WALK 20-30 min., and be sure to take the Zinc,w/food or it WILL make you sick---people have posted experiencing significant differences in muscle taming using Zinc. You may not yet be able or feel like dressing and going outside to walk. Its best if you can to get fresh air, but if you can't just walk around your house. I about wore my carpet and stairs out I think. When I planned my second detox I used one those small home exercise joggers, about $25 and it stores well on its side.

Detox is truly a battle of strength of wills; yours against the drug demon that has taken up residence in your body. You have to do the work and handle your own exorcism of the demon you let get ahold of you. You need to get YOU back in the driver seat of YOUR life again and in charge of YOUR destiny. Otherwise you are just along for the ride of wherever you are allowing that drug demon to take you. If you aren't steering your own wheel, then WHO is??? Scarey thought, isn't it? How could one reasonably expect to not crash and burn if you are allowing an addiction to determine and guide the course of YOUR life???? It's a difficult issue to face. We have all been there. But, once you ask yourself those questions and knowingly don't take charge of your direction, there isn't much left but for your loved ones to watch the flame burn out and mourn the loss of wonderful soul from their life, because even as a living being you aren't a full functioning loved one meeting anyone's needs-----not even your own.
Hi jam. I don't know how long you have been clean, maybe I've missed that somewhere. But I can tell you that for me "short term" pain killers is how I got myself into trouble and onto a horrid roller coaster ride that lasted over a year. I am not trying to be pessimistic. There were times in my 11 years of clontinuous clean time that I had to have pain killers and truly took them short term, flushed the rest and didn't look back. Like, 4 years ago I had a hysterectomy. I took meds in the hospital through IV for about 12 hours after surgery. Went home with a prescription for Percocet and Mepergan if needed. I took Percocet like 3 times in the next 2 days and flushed the rest - never looked back.

But in August 2004 I injured myself at work. Long story short I was hooked on Hydro before I knew what hit me. Part of it for me was relaxing my program, not talking to others about what I was going through and keeping the idea in my head that I could handle it. I didn't get off them until September 2005 and then spent another several months battling another addiction to a product that was 10 times more horrible. I have now finally been off that for 6 days. The key for me has been talking about it, sharing with others (I'm involved in NA), going to therapy, being honest with my family, journaling, reading recovery related materials, light exercise and other uplifting things to keep myself occupied. I have been dancing around the house this morning to some of my teenage sons music :D . As ridiculous as that might sound....I feel so much better.

I guess my advice would be to keep the focus on recovery, share with someone close to you that can help keep you in check, get involved in meetings if you feel comfortable doing that, buy or print out some recovery related materials and read, post here or on other recovery centered boards, write and ofcourse follow your own wonderful advice about supplements and other aids to keep the focus.

God bless and good luck.
Hi Shelley, I am happy to offer suggestions for you to consider and decide for yourself on your best options as I am not a medical professional. I am very sorry about your bout with cancer, prayers are with you. Very glad you recognized dependency signs and commenced a taper reduction...good for you!!! congratulations!!!

Now, first regarding the symptoms you describe. They sound exactly like what would occur with drug withdrawals (WDs). According to the quick online research, Norco is a combination opiate derivative of both Hydrocodone (vicodin) and acetaminophen (tylenol). While WDs can vary from person to person based on individual unique chemistry balances, the typical universal WD patterns are the same as the worst flu one could imagine. In particular, the back and joint pain you describe would be very consistent opiate WDs. For some people days 3-4 are the worst and for others it can be days 5-6. The taper reduction you followed sounds like you may have tapered too quickly. Drug taper recommendations seem to vary greatly depending on the source. I have read varying taper dose recommendations that include, but are certainly not limited to, the following.

Taper dose by 20-25%:
-every 3-7 days (total taper elimiation would equal approximately 30 days)
-every 30 days (total taper elimation would equal 4-5 months)

So, it sounds like you did the total taper, 100% reduction, in about a week if I am reading your post correctly. If correct, then that sounds like a very fast taper, and would not likely eliminate or perhaps even lessen WDs. None of that is neither here or there since the good news is that you now at 4 or 5 days off:) Shelley, hang tough are going through the worst....know that when it is at its worst is when it is about to turn the corner and get NOT have come too far.

Next phase is that you go through your central nervous system and muscles transitioning from the drug-deadened state they have been in as a result of external blocking.....your legs will at first feel very they are on somebody else's will be hard but not completely impossible to motivate....just rest as much as you will pass in about 12-24 hours.....but, it will be replaced by restless legs where the nerve endings and muscles are coming to life may experience lil electrical sensory tingling where at times it feels like you are having difficulty just being still with yourself....HOT BATHS....AS MANY AS YOU WANT TO TAKE AND AS HOT AS YOU CAN STAND IT.. (I took 6-10 hot baths a day), Use ASPERCREME if you have it and if not...heating pad or fill cotton socks with rice and make hot rice packs ...2 min in microwave....once the heavy legs stop and the electric legs start you MUST exercise...hard I know because you will be exhausted but you takes 20-30 min a day to jumpstart your body's own natural endorphin system to produce its own natural dopamine which is the body's defense chemistry against pain, depression, and supports sleep cycle. The vitamin/nutritional mega-dose supplements are intended to only help bridge the process until your body can start producing for itself. The human body is truly a WILL produce what it needs when it is not interfered with by external factors. What has happened is when we introduced external products (painkillers) into our body's factory our brains read the signals and therefore responded by shutting down the factory since the supply was being externally provided. When you abruptly withdraw the external supply, and whoaaaaaaaaaa, the ole body jumps up and down, alarm bells start clanging like mad...aka WDs.....all signaling alerts.....heyyyyyyyyyyy she quit taking the s**t!!!! All your lil internal workmen are kicking the crap out of each other and YOU and running around looking for their equipment....they are not used to functioning together after the longggggggggggggg coffeebreak they have been on for months or years, however long you have been providing the external supply. But, they WILL get their act together and get back on the job and start producing what your body needs. The event that coordinates them is places an external demand on the system for more gojuice and fast....the more the demand (exercise) the more quickly organized they will develops an internal rhythm for them where they function to the beat. It may all sound crazy, but it is true. If you can make yourself exercise for 20-30 min a can be only walking.....we are not talking marathon running here.....start out gradual and build up...begin as soon as you can with the muscle tightening/relaxing exercises outlined in the Detox post ....then begin exercises as soon as you can even if only 5 min at time ...just do it 6 times a day and build up...just do what you can and as much as you can. After you are able to reach 20-30 min you will feel a difference within an hour of stopping. Once you start to feel it, and you WILL---I guarantee it, your own personal experience will motivate you to do more. You are sooooooooooooo close to victory lane Shelley!!!! Reread the Vicodin Home Remedy Detox post I did...there are many OTC options and suggestions.
jam338, you are truly a gift from God. I have had horrible abdominal pain for 2 days now. when i called my internist she said i went off the norco way to quick and that i should take a norco and call a detox doctor on monday to get help to do this. my husband does not want me to take a pill and he thinks i should just bite the bullet. but even as you explained i really did go off very fast. i feel like a failure if i take a pill after a week of no pills. i have not slept due to all the pain. i also have left over pain from my 6 months of chemo so i am not even sure if the pain i have is detox or just cancer pain. what do you think? do you think i should take a norco tonight and just give my body a break and then on monday start with a professional? it seems that all oyu people were able to do it on your own and were taking many more pills daily then my 6 or 7. i am so confused. i actually only have 3 norco left so it is not like i can take any more then 1 per day. what is your experience with htis? i trust your opinion. again, thank you for taking the time to help a complete stranger. regards, shelley :angel:
Here I am again, 23 months after going through detox and rehab from Benzos and hydros. I was using them by docs increasing prescription because I have a severe case or Restless Legs Syndrome. They worked, so I thought what the heck. Accelerated the dose because of tolereance to the point of abuse. Lost my job because of abuse. I was clean for 17 months, blew a calf muscle playing racquetball and went to a doc in the box. PUT ON MY CHART THAT I WAS IN ADDICTION RECOVERY. He prescribed soma and hydro for the pain any way. Like an idiot, I filled them both.

Did OK for awhile, but went back to my sources for hydro. Been on them again for 6 months. At one time I was up to 10-12 a day. For the last couple of weeks it's been 5-6. I tried tapering. Didn't work. Decided to go cold turkey. I filled one last hydro prescription to do the taper "right." Listen to how smart I am: I bought valium 10s to help me sleep and with the restless legs as went through home detox. I haven't taken more than 2 per night for less than a week. But I've got a a very large supply of those.

Now I'm out of hydro as of last night. Used my last 3. So here I am ready to go cold turkey. Nobody knows this but me. I can't stand the shame of my wife knowing that I've relapsed. One lucky thing is that because of my job, we live apart during the week, so she only sees me on weekends or every other weekend. (Probably one of the reasons I decided it was OK to use again.) Even though I was down to about a 6 a night (didn't use during the day, only in the evenings), I've already started with the body aches, flu-like symptoms, restlessness, agitation, the whole nine yards.

I know I can do this. Even when I went through rehab under the doc's care the last time, it was pretty much cold anti-depressants, no kind of medicine to help with the wd...two weeks of hell. The doc kept saying, "No one every died from lack of sleep or body aches." So I just toughed it out.

The kicker is that I am a well-known man, in a small town area and the AA/NA thing is a no go locally. I was put out of my profession for a year and just got back in. If it becomes known that I relapsed by my superiors, I'm done.

I'm ready to go cold turkey. I called in sick today and am ready to ask for two weeks vacation to get over the "flu."

I've read some of the helps listed above. Just want to know how effective they are and what else I can do?

I need some help, advice, and encouragement. Please. I feel so sad and so lonely, not to mention the shame. I promised myself and everyone I love that I would never be here again, and yet here I am. God, I need help and there is no one, no friend, no one I can think of that I can talk to about this mess

I'm on Cymbalta (anti-depressant), Trileptal for axiety (an epilepsy drug), and a small dose of mirapex for the restless legs that is decreasing in its effectiveness. I am not suicidal, but I am so depressed and so alienated, My job is a "help others" job and I smile and am pleasant to get through the day, but as I am coming off the hydro, at home it's tears and walking the floor for how stupid I am. How can I be so dumb having been through this so recently. I understand if no one replies. There's good advice above. The pain, along with the shame and isolation of living alone six days a week is awful when I'm sober. It's even worse battling this addiction.

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