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Hi to All
My name is Patty- this is the first time I have been to this board- I truly hope some-one can help! I have been on Pain Medication now for about 7 years. This is the result of a couple of car accidents.

I thought I would mention I do have lots of Chemical Sensitivites but have have been taking Endone 5mg 4 times a day now for 2 years- before this I was on Oxycontin but this somehow got changed when I was in hospital at one stage.
Recently I have been feeling extremely "knocked" around from the medication. I have no energy to even do simple things (I am not sure if the medication is the problem or there is something else happening -i.e thyroid and the medication is making things worse).
Anyway MY GP decided I should change to oxycontin after he saw me last Wednesday- he told me to take 10mg twice a day. On Thursday morning I took one 10mg Oxycontin and was totally wiped out for the rest on the day.
The next day I tried to take 5mg oxycontin Three times a day as discussed with doctor-and 2.5 mg endone last thing a night- again my body just fell into a heap. During this time I have been taking panadol and condeine about every 6 hours as I seem to have a bit of "fever"
I have now been told to take 5mg oxycontin twice a day-still feeling drained. - this is just starting, it is now about 11 hours since last dose.
I don't want to go into unplanned W/D's... I am starting to wonder if the oxycontin is causing more problems than the Endone. Whether it is the opiates causing the problem or they are just re-acting to something else that is going on within my body.
Sorry I don't mean to be vague I am confused, feel emtremely unwell and worried.
Please ask me any questions you like I will answer them as honestly as I know.
Thankyou for reading this I hope to hear from some-one very soon.
Sincerely
Patty
i am just a bit confused here about a couple of things.number one,i 'think' you are inadvertantly interspersing oxycontin for oxycodone since i know they do not actually make a 5 mg oxycontin.why the codiene?you can by tylenol for fevers without the codiene.i do think the codiene may be your biggest problem.oxycontin shouldn't be giving you that much added drowsiness or affect since it is a very slow release med.you are actually only getting 5mgs after the firstt hour you take it,then another 5 mgs at around six hours.i am thinking that the Endone is actually like endocet or percocet here?5mgs of oxycodone,with tylenol?you are i do think already getting enough tylenol(if this is indeed the same thing?) just from the amount of the endone you are actually taking thru out the day.i would drop the codeine and see how you feel.

in pain management,the idea of actually taking a long acting med like oxycontin is to get rid of the need to have to be taking pills all day long.the endone should actually be used only as a break thru med when your pain "breaks thru' your base med.in order to best manage pain with the use of oxycontin(or any other long acting pain med),your doc should ideally be raising the OC amount to meet your pain then only allowing the endone for BT pain.do you know what i am saying?the OC "should' eventually be taking the edge off so there is no need(except BT pain) to have to keep regularly taking added pills.that is how the oxycontin was ment to be used in pain management really.and your doc IS so right about the OC not making the claimed by perdue(manufacturer) full 12 hours.it handles about 8-10 for mine,and my PM doc also is aware of this.he could have you take the OC either three times a day or just raise the amount you are on,after he takes you off all other added pain meds except with BT pain.he should be titrating you up on the OC while taking you off the short acting endone,and dropping that codiene all together.codiene tends to really make me very sleepy but i do fine with oxycodone.the oxycontin just should not be the drug that is giving you the biggest problems.try dropping the codiene for a few days or all together and see what happenes with regards to your lack of energy.like i said before,the first release of only 5mgs of oxycodone is at one hour after ingestion and the next at around six,so i realistically cannot see this as being the problem.how long ago did you actually add the codeine?8mgs is enough to send you to sleepy land if you have a level of sensitivity to it.if you didn't have this problem with just endone,you shouldn't be having this problem with the added two doses of the OC it releases.the codiene just makes more sense.

just out of curiosity,just how much tylenol are you actually taking in in any given day?it should state the tylenol amount on the bottles.you need to add up the total.you really do need to add up your average intake daily.let me know what that is when you figure it out will ya?

the very best thing you can do if you are trying to really manage some severe pain here is to have your doc titrate you up to about 20 mgs at least twice a day(possibly 3 depending on your real pain) and have the endone used only when your pain really does break thru your base med,with a limit on how many endone you can actually take in one day.you just have alot of narcotics there that i don't think are being used in the right way.you personally have too much control over what you take and when and when dealing with strong narcotics,that is just a recipe for possible disaster with a strong potential for addiction beginning at some point.he needs to set you in a scheduled dosing plan that you agree to stick to.this is the best possible way to do pain management.any other way,espescially when using short acting meds,just leaves to much left to you.you just need direction and guidelines to stick to in this type of situation,you have to.it really IS in YOUR best interest.good luck,marcia
HI Slippy Slope and Feelbad
Thankyou for your responses. NO, I don't think I have an addiction as yet, as my GP reminds me the way I dropped from 80mg to 20mg/10mg twice a day unsupervised was amazing. I think he just wants me to get on some Medication that suits me, before he changed me over last week the Endone 4x daily was wiping me out (but then I was having heaps of late nights-too many- not good)
The past 24 hours has been horrid- with this awful headache I have taken more TYenol and codeine ( I expect the headache is from reducing the Endone too rapidly) I think I worked out yesterday in fact the GP had taken 10mg daily off the previous dose... so this is causing problems too much too soon. The way I feel currently I am wondering if the Tyenol and codeine are causing the major problems not so much the opiates.
So, what your saying Feelbad, if I was taking 10mg oxycontin SR twice a day I would be getting the same as if I was taking the Endone 5mg- 4 x daily?? maybe I should do this as an interim...
Thankyou for telling me about the other board I did not know it existed I will check it out. I know I need some supervision.
Thankyou :) :)
Patty62
[B]Sweet Marcia[/B]

It would take a heck of a lot more than your post to offned me! Your words in all your posts are just to sincere and caring to ever take offense!

Actually, I think we are agreeing here. I do not see Patty as an addict in the truest sense. I see her very much as myself... someone who is displaying adictive behaviour after long term use of opiates for pain. Unlike your son's anti-rejection meds, use of opiates do indeed mandate ever-incresaing dosages to do the same job over exteneded use. Od course we become dependent! However, whether we use opiates for chronic pain or addiction need, eventually we will all end up in the same boat... the opiates will control our lives.

Believe me, I am no martyr when it comes to pain! However, my experience says that less of an opiate is not going to do the pain relief job that increasing amounts do. the dosages just have to be upped over time or changed to stronger meds to keep attaining the exact same pain relief. And this is where the huge problems began for me. The higher, stronger, longer use leads to medical issues and emotional issues like depression. Leads to a lack of functioning. I just can not see any way around it. I know that some doctors employ "med vacations, " but for ME that is just not an option. I do strongly believe that somewhere along the line the use of opiate meds for chronic pain does truly lead to self medication. I think the emotional side effects of long twerm use leads to chronic depression and we begin to medicate more to relieve the depression than the pain. And thus begins the addictive behavior. I think the truer addict begins to self medicate right from the get-go for emotional pain.

[B]Patty[/B], I do not know for sure what your plan should be. Total withdrawal or controlled use. This is something you and your doctor must decide. I can best share only my journey and along with it some of the information I have garnered.

As you can see in black and white here, even good friends on the board can difffer in opinions! We each must learn to gather the information that is most useful to us. Do not let differences of opinions frighten you. the great thing about the anonymity of this site is that it allows total honesty as we each perceive it. I preach from my pulpit because of my own experiences. Marcia preaches from hers because of her life experiences. Both of us, however, look forward to the day that you can preach from your own pulpit whatever your choices may be. Smiles.

Peace All
reach
hey patty,just how long ago was that hepatic panel done on your liver?this could be from a few different things but it really does need to be followed up with a repeat set soon just to see if there is any trend going on with the liver.just precautionary,it is a bit higher than it should be.were your kidney labs done at that same time or recently?it wouldn't hurt to just follow up on bith liver and kidney,they do get affected with tylenol usuage.just some thoughts there.

honestly patty,i really DO think you need to move onto a doc who really does know what the heck they are doing.no doc should be leaving anything like a taper or even figureing our your very own dosing scehdule up to the patient,espescially with narcotics.there is too much room for trouble down the road,not to mention the fact that you cannot get good coverage for your pain without a good plan set up for you to follow,to the letter.a good pain management doc and clinic i think could just offer you so many other options to try and control your pain that do not involve the use of any narcotics or a combo of modalities and narcotics and other meds like the anti siezures which work much more effectively on nerve related pain.this doc just seems pretty pathetic to me.you also most definitely DO need more structure,accountability and guidelines that a good pain clinic offers you,this would help prevent alot of huge problems including possible addiction from occuring at some point.i ,myself,just could not possibly do my pain management in any other way other than with all the strict guidelines that just come with pain management facilitys.and my contract,which i just happened to have to update yesterday at my PM clinic,along with dropping off my suprise UA.such fun.but it keeps me compliant and that is the key here.accountability to someone and full compliance once your dosing schedule is set in writing.you personally just have to much control and that needs to change to just make things much safer for you,in many ways.

your headaches cold be coming from a few different things,one of which could be(if you are on generic)the oxycontin.i got the worst dang headaches from anything other than the name brand oxycontin,just horrible side effects that i never get with the name brand OC at all.just one thought.ice packs at the base of my neck and on the forehead really help with some of my headaches that pop in from time to time from my aneurysm,and my really messed up c spine issues.ice can do alot for pain when used for certain pain issues in the right way.

i just think you really do need to move onto another doc at an actual pain management facility at this point,this doc is just not doing enough for you and in the right way either.you would have alot of other options thru a good PM clinic that you just cannot obtain thru any other type of facility.and the accontability.i rely more on outside or more topical types of pain management than i do on narcotics,and thats the way i would really love to keep it.there are just many other ways to handle pain and pain flares other than upping your narcotic dosage.if i asked for a raise in my OC everytime my pain has decided to up itself over these past few yaers,heck i would be in there every other month.this just forced me to try new and different things to try and manage flares and the progression of many of my pain issues.i have only actually asked for and recieved one 20mg raise in my OC since i was first stabilized on it back in early 04.when things hit the fan with my knee over that summer,i asked to try the TENS unit instead of asking for a raise in my meds.the very first time i felt i really needed a raise.my PM and myself just sat down and tried to map my pain a bit by assessing my best and worst times of day.by doing this,we were able to actually take 20mgs from my normal night dose when my pain is actually at its best just because the posistion is soo much better for many areas that are real nasty when i am up and moble,and we placed that 20mgs at the midday dose and raised that.this really worked out great and i really didn't miss that 20mg part of my night dose at all,and i never actually needed that raise then(ended up definitely needing a raise when i blew the meniscus out the sides in my "already waiting for surgery knee").this is how good pain management should work.they really just try and target the worst of the worst in the best and smartest ways possible while minimizing the overall narcotic taken.this is really what i think would benefit you the most.just ask your current doc for a referral to a good pain management facility and just tell him you just want that oversight and be able to try other options that only they can really offer you.i just really don't think your current doc really has a freaking clue as how to really actually treat chronic pain.you need better guidance here thats all.i hope things will get better soon for you patty.make sure to follow up with that out of range liver enzyme too,and the kidney labs as well.please keep us posted hon,K?Marcia





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