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Hi there, I'm really sorry if what I said seemed like a low blow. I didn't want to make you feel any worse or hurt any more than you already are, and I sincerely apologize for doing so. When you say that I caught the whole story, am I right to assume that means that the thing you discovered that made you finally leave was that he had a child with his girlfriend? If so, I think you should consider the possibility that he is changed and decent now, but not because he's magically become a great, honest, loyal, and trustworthy boyfriend. I highly doubt that is the case, but it is quite possible that having a child has made him change his cheating ways (though I'm not at all sure that's the case either). Sometimes it takes a baby to snap someone into shape and make them finally grow up a bit and realize they've been acting like a spoiled child with no regard for other people's feelings. Anyway, if that's what happened, I can certainly see how that would be incredibly painful for you and I'm really sorry that things turned out the way they did.

You are such a sweet and caring woman who deserves so much better than this guy can give anyone, please believe that. It makes me really mad that there are people out there who end up hurting such kind, well-meaning people with their deceptive, sleazy behavior. You said at one point that his GF cheated on him right back, and I wonder if it might help you a little to think that you're too honest, loving, and devoted for him, and that he knows that he doesn't deserve a woman like that but instead belongs with a lying cheater like himself. I really think the best thing you ever did was turning your back on this man and while I know you don't feel like you've moved on, having followed your story for some time now, I don't think that's the case at all. You have made a lot of progress in putting your past behind you and you really need to give yourself the credit you deserve for that, difficult as it has been. You gave him everything you had, but unfortunately he is just not the one for you, and I think deep down you know that getting involved with him again would hurt you terribly and be almost impossible to recover from, or you wouldn't have posted here. It makes me quite scared for you to think what letting him back into your life might do to your emotional well-being at this him up the first time seemed to take all the strength and determination you have, and I'm very worried that you might not be able to summon that willpower a second time if he got his claws into you again.

I would hate to see such a romantic and caring person end up stuck in a no-win situation with a man who will never reciprocate her love and devotion, when you are still so young, with so much to offer, that it can't be long before you meet another man who will love you truly and completely, with his whole heart, to an extent where he's disgusted by the idea of being with any other woman. You deserve nothing less than the fairy tale kind of love and commitment you wanted with your ex but that he could never give you, or anyone else in all likelihood. It's hard to believe when you're lonely and missing an ex, but there really are wonderful, honest men out there who would give anything for a chance to show you what true love is all about and ease all the pain you've been through. Getting involved again with your ex would end up hurting you more than anyone in that you'd be perenially unsatisfied, settling for second-best and only a portion of his heart when you want and need a man to love you and only you with his entire heart Between you, him, and his GF, you are the only one with the sensitivity and conscience to be deeply wounded by getting involved with him again, and I would really hate to see that happen. I know you don't agree with me on most issues, and I think that's because at some level we are fundamentally different (as are Nini and I) in that you feel pain, loss, and betrayal on a level deeper than I can feel or even fully comprehend. For better or worse, some people are just more sensitive and vulnerable than others, and you seem to be one of those people who needs to take special precautions in order to shield yourself from being hurt by someone more callous like your ex, who can't really even understand the heartbreak he's caused you. You are so right, Lisa, that you are not a bad person, in fact you're much further from it than most people are, and that is why it worries me so to think of you getting back into such a toxic situation. I'm afraid that being the woman on the side again would make you feel like a bad person, and that you might never recover from the pain and guilt it would inflict on you, especially with a baby involved...that was the only reason I brought up the child thing, because I can't imagine it wouldn't make you feel really terrible to endanger the stability a baby needs from his parents.

It really seems to me like the idea you're considering could do irreparable damage to you in numerous ways, and on top of the additional heartbreak it would bring you, it would also be truly tragic to see you deny yourself the possibility of happiness with someone who loves you as much as you love him. Wasting anymore time with a man who can't love you the way you want will only prevent you from finding and embracing a man who can, and I think that's what you want deep down more than anything. It's impossible, after you lose your first love, to believe you will ever feel that way again until it happens, but it does happen, as anyone who has loved more than once can tell you. But almost everyone fails to believe in this possibility until they actually experience it and are proved wrong, so no matter how strongly you believe you can never love anyone like you loved him, please have a little hope and know that millions of people have felt just as strongly up until the moment they fell in love again. I would just hate to see you deny yourself the opportunity to be proved wrong and find love again within a much happier and healthy relationship. It can and does happen...please don't give up hope and fall back into a relationship you know can never be what you want from a love affair, OK?

I know you're going through a terrible amount of pain and it seems now like anything would be worth doing as long as it made you feel better, but I think you also know that what you're thinking of would only cause you infinitely more pain in the long run...kind of like when an addict falls off the wagon in hopes of easing his pain for a minute, only to relapse into a lifetime of addiction and misery which is much worse than any pain he experienced during sobriety. I really wish I had some easy answer as to how you can ease your pain and let go, but unfortunately strong feelings can't be easily overcome. But I do think you're right that denying the truth about your ex hasn't really helped ease your pain either, and that it is time for you to start accepting reality and break free of denial. Holding onto the hurt may seem safer and easier than letting go, but it will end up hurting you so much more in the long run if you aren't able to free yourself of this pain. I so wish I could do that for you or give you some easy tips to accomplish it, but it's something you have to do on your own that will take a great deal of time, effort, and diligence. One thing that I think would help is if you could seek the assistance of a good counselor or therapist, even a clergy person if you're at all religious. Even if you don't have money for it, there are resources out there to help people overcome unhealthy relationships, and any local women's shelter or women's charity should be able to help you find someone that can work with you toward acceptance and letting go. Please, please believe that you did reclaim your self-respect and that his saying you did him wrong was just more lies and manipulation. You deserve better, and you can find a better love, but first you must let go of this man and all the hurt he has caused are going to need to come to terms with it and commit it once and for all to the past in order to open your heart to the kind of love that will make you feel happy and secure, rather than so often guilty and confused as your ex made you feel. You really need to stop letting your happiness depend on what he does and feels and accept that the only thing you can control is what you do and feel. Please, please don't settle and sell yourself short by going back to him...there is something better out there, and if you don't give up and take what seems to be the easiest, most painless path now, you can and will find it. We will be here for you every step of the is time to start the next phase of your life and leave him and all his lies in your dust :angel:.
[QUOTE=LostMyHeart]Well, what if I called his friend, instead? And "hung out" with him one night? Would that be just as stupid?
There's just no one to call. I know I should be loooking for something else to make me feel better, but I know this would work, even if short term. But would I regret it?
Plus, I got with his friend before. And my ex hated me for it, and he would hate me more if I did it again, but why should I care.[/QUOTE] Why would you like to do something so self destructive??? You may think that this will hurt your ex as much as he hurt you but the only one you will be hurting is yourself. Of course you may even be thinking that you deserve to be hurt in such a way....but you are WRONG!!! Calling & getting with his friend is just going to make things will only repeat the viscious cycle of reminding you of the same behavior that you hate yourself for at this point in time. The only way you can truly heal is to accept that you made mistakes and that you ex did too and that 2 wrongs will never make it right. :nono: No, LostMYHeart.....calling your ex and getting with his friend is not the solution.

[QUOTE=LostMyHeart]I know this is all irrelevant now, but I've kept it locked inside, maybe I should let it out:
That's why I'm afraid it's my fault we didn't work out, cause I got with his friend. He talked to me about the baby thing, and shortly after I had a night with his friend. I can't call that cheating or anything, as we weren't in any technical terms "committed", and he had done something even worse to me right before that. That's why I did it, I was hurt and made a rash choice, without thinking. I told my ex beforehand that that was it and I wasn't going to be with him anymore. Then I called his friend.
A week went by and I regretted it all. When he finally talked to me again, everything was just different from that point on. We still stayed involved, but he never acted the same. Until right before it ended for good. I talked to his friend one day and straightened it all out with him. I'm pretty sure he forgave me after that- I could just tell in the way he acted, like it was back to normal. He even "let" me be around his friend, and didn't make any smart comments afterwards.
But I'm afraid that's why he chose her. It's my fault. Even though she cheated on him. Because he said I was so horrible for what I did, because it was his friend. That's not why I got with the friend - I just had no one else to call, and he seems to give me "the right kind of attention" when I'm feeling down and out.
But everyone I know, including my friend who knows him, tells me it wouldn't have made a difference whether I had done what I did or not. That I wasn't wrong, considering he wasn't my bf. And look at the things he does to people, he has no place to tell me anything about my choices.
But I'm still afraid that's the reason. I know he believed I would never do that to him, and I feel like I let him down. I was the only one being good to him - then I went and disappointed him and became "like all the others".[/QUOTE]

LostMy need to forgive yourself....I know that you got with his friend as a way to hurt him but your freind is right, whether you did this or not, your ex would still be with his GF even if you didn't. So PLEASE, put this all behind you and do not go on believing that this is your fault. You are living with too much guilt and you are not going to change things by what you are are only going to destroy yourself by doing these things. You need to say to yourself...."I screwed up and I am sorry. I need to forgive myself and not do this again." We are not perfect and when we do wrong we are forgiven by others and have to learn to forgive ourselves as well. I think it's time to give yourself this gift of realizing you made a mistake and have learned from it and move on to do better next time. To go the other way is in my opinion self destructive. Please know that you are not the first person to make a mistake and that you deserve to be happy. Only you are capable of controlling that.

(((HUGS))) ~ Goody :wave:

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