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[QUOTE=chevyman;4013075]marilyn60,
This thread was about me and her, our crazy realtionship romatic or ever how you want to put it... and for me to get advice on how to deal with this type of a woman....to better my realtionship with her.
I'm just a stubborn man and takes a lot to get through to me.

I'm just not use to being in a realtionship where everything is planned...and of course her being a non-emotional and non- affectionate woman don't help matters any.

I can't cope with that...I thought I could but I can't I was only fooling myself and thinking that this realtionship (her) was the best thing that ever happen to me...I was wrongand blind.

I ask her over and over to be more affectionate with me and appreciate me more/not meaning the things I get her or help her with or for the sex..as you may think grrr its much much more deeper than that I'm a non-merterialistic person , However I do like to give more than I take and of course I wanted her to say she loves me with all her heart...she said she just coudn't...I ask ''why not '' if you love me say you do'' she would not say it...I begain to remove my clothes from her closet and take some of my things ... she ask me what I was doing I told her this realtionship is over I still love her and we will be good friends but until I know forsure she loves me..I'm just going to be alone for a while and not date any woman....she got mad and said fine...storm out , I Left crying and this is how it eneded this last weekend...maybe your right about all you said in your post maybe I am selfesh person and wanted to much and expected to much from her....but your wrong about me being a player or hurt her in anyway, I'd never be a player to any women I care about.
I see where I was wrong/blind and I'm sorry to everyone that tried to wake me up....rose, red, bloke hollar, choclate jessica, larryloumom,and others.

I never meant or had bad intentions saying things about her on the internet Actually I don't think I said enough , the things I did say were just a few negitive things I needed help with...Anyway I would never say anything on this board that I did'nt care if she read it or not thats the truth.

I'm not a player and I am appalled that you would say such a thing.
Have a good day..bye
chevyman.[/QUOTE]



Hi Chevyman,

Please don't take my words wrong now...I only have kind thoughts toward you and I think you are a very nice guy. And like I said, you don't owe anyone to marry them and you don't have to be married. I seriously doubt that you are attracted to users or abusers. I bet she is a really lovely person. I just hate to see you throw this relationship away over hurt feelings or comments against her by people that do not know her. I think both you and she deserve more than that. I'm not saying she was "the one" or that you blew it. I'm just saying that none of us got to read her side of this or what kind of pressure she may have felt from you, even though you did not intentionally pressure her.

It's very good to take a break if we feel unsure we want to be in a relationship. I regularly take breaks from my very best friends and even from my family. Then I have a new appreciation when I am with them. There is a saying that "familiarity breeds contempt". The concept comes from the fact that the more we get to know someone, the more likely we are to find fault with them.

[COLOR="Magenta"]Mark Twain wrote this~
Familiarity breeds contempt. How accurate that is. The reason we hold truth in such respect is because we have so little opportunity to get familiar with it.[/COLOR]

I know that if I am getting negative about anyone I need to spend some time alone to look at my own faults and change my own attitude. To me it's refreshing to spend time alone. I can regroup and go back to my relationships with new energy and a better perspective. I personally cannot keep on dealing with anyone without having breaks from them. It's not anything about or against them...it's how I am. I think we all need our own space...and no, I would not explain to anyone what I am doing by myself...we all need private time. Anyone that loves me respects that my space is mine alone. If they are insecure about what I do by myself then they have a security issue, and unless I have given them reason to believe I am unfaithful to them, which I never have, then they need to own their insecurity and not blame me for it.

Have you ever thought that this lady might have spent her time away to be alone to grieve the loss of her husband and that she doesn't want to tell you because she fears you might take that to mean she doesn't care enough for you? Instead of assuming her privacy is a negative, why not assume she was doing something for herself that she needed and be happy for her? Why not take it as a positive? is she really a demanding person, or is she really pleasant and friendly?

I don't know you or her and I don't pretend that I do. I only give my objective opinion of what you have written because you asked for advice. I see you are a capable person, so I don't think I need to protect you from her. You are very capable of protecting yourself. I'm sharing what I think would help you have a better relationship with the a lady you find attractive and interesting....I'm taking the time to share because you do seem to want your opposite sex relationships to work out and you have asked. I think if we don't learn our side of this and if we keep saying a relationship failure was the other person's fault that we seriously short change ourselves, that we cannot grow or better ourselves...and that would be too bad since we have no one else that we can change but ourselves. Giving up on someone is not the same thing as making positive changes in ourselves to affect our relationships positively.

I don't see anything you wrote that indicates that she is not a nice lady. Could it be that while you really were hoping things would just "fall into place" with this lady, you were not really that in to her? Honestly, people can sense when we are not that in to them, and then naturally hold back when they can tell they are not accepted just as they are. Maybe you were trying to make yourself be that into her, but you just were not. That's not a crime, but I think you should own why you are leaving her and not act like she wronged you or owed you more than she was ready or wanted to give. Don't you think if you were that in to her as she is, you would be attracted to and enjoy her as she is? From what I have read, and maybe I am wrong, but you seem to genuinely distrust and dislike who she really is.

That you have very good intentions doesn't mean that she would be OK with you sharing details about her to people that don't know her esp. when she isn't sharing her side of the relationship and how your attitude affects her. It could be that she feels you pressure her and are over-bearing and demanding...would you be shocked if she told you she felt that? Why not ask her? Your relationship won't have a chance if you only ask us and not her how you affect her. You have to be willing to hear the truth of what she feels and to own your side of why things don't work between you. Marriage, if you ever want to be married, requires being willing to hear the other person's point of view whether it feels great or not. Really unless you know her side of this you will be doomed to stay the same and repeat the same scenario with a different woman.

I find it strange that anyone would judge her without hearing her side of this. There is no way to be able to give you a truly balanced view when we cannot hear from each one of you. I can't imagaine a counselor giving a negative opinion about a mate that was not there to present her side of the relationship. I just think it is not responsible to make judgements on your lady friend based only on what you feel. If you believe she would not care about what you wrote here why not tell her and let her read your posts? Of course I would not recommend doing so if you have any hopes that she will miss you and come toward you in future.

Maybe you do need to get used to "plans"...after all, hanging too loose can make one more insecure. I mean you tried too hard to force her into words she was not to ready to give so backing off from her is reasonable...but not if you are blaming her why you you choose to back off. Really you aren't backing off because you made a mistake in choosing her, but because you simply don't want to be married, isn't that true? that's what the title of this thread says.

I wish you had been honest with her and told her that you just want to be loved and don't want to be married instead of leaving her with the idea that she somehow wronged you....it really was not about whether she loves you, is it, when you kept telling us you know she does. Don't listen to anyone tell you she doesn't love you or she doesn't love you "enough"...my goodness what is "enough"? Do words equal a relationship? It seems that your relationship was way more than a few words. Wasn't it? Are a few words all that matters? Personally I don't care at all about hearing I am sorry or I love you...anyone can and does say those words. I want to see love in action. But that's just me.

Anyway, Chevyman, I know it's your life and you will do what you want. I hope you take what I wrote with a grain of salt and that you at least think about it and see if anything I said makes sense to you or sinks in.
[QUOTE=chevyman;4013828]Thank you marilyn60, long post thanks for taking your time to write your concerns and advise I appreciate it, but I'm not a player to her or any other woman.

I still have not heard a word from her, were both stobborn as mules, neither of us will give an inch.

I'm not mistaken rather or not I Love her, I do, I'm only guessing but I think she loves me ... its just that she won't tell me she does and expects me to read her mind that deep down she knows she Loves me, but until I'm sure she does, I'm staying faithful to her, I don't won't anyone else, maybe later on if she keeps this up...yeah I'll move on.
I never had these feelings with anyone the way I feel about her..so yeah it hurts deep...but I'll get over it...just need some time alone.
she is hurting too.
and love is suppose to feel good?

Thanks everyone for the kind words, I appreiciate each and everyone of you guys.[/QUOTE]

Chevy,

You're so welcome. It's my pleasure to write to you.

I'm glad you are leaving her alone for now while work your emotions out. I hope you will dwell on yourself and what you really want out of life. I just don't believe you would fall for a lady that is so shallow as to only want to marry you just to impress others, or anything else except she wants to be with YOU. I don't believe she is like that...I think she [U]is proud of you[/U]and of being with you, because she knows you are a lovely and decent man...why can't you trust that she can see what a good guy you are? You don't have to marry her if you don't want to...but I think that she wants you she is paying you a compliment.

We have to believe in ourselves, before we can believe we are loved. Yes, I totally believe in you that you can reach this understanding of yourself, too. You need your space right now, and she needs hers. It isn't because either of you are not worth the effort...you both are. Right now you each need to take care of yourselves.

I think you are completely right that you [U]can[/U]get over this burning desire to have a woman make you feel secure, and that you [U]can[/U] learn to feel secure in yourself apart from what others do or don't do for you. I used to be hypersensitive, and I still have my down times, but I basically made my mind up to be happy with myself no matter what others do or think of me. I have basically been fine ever since....Fine when we are together and agreeing, and fine when we are not agreeable and are taking space from each other.

As your lady friend knows, she can't put her happiness all into another person, who may leave or may die. You know this too in your heart. Do you feel selfish being happy by yourself?...I think it's selfish not to. I think we are a burden to others if we can't be happy on our own no matter what others do or say. No one that loves us wants us to fall apart or be devastated when they need their space.

You are right that love hurts. Love also feels good. Other times love is just pleasant or mildly boring...emtions change all of the time. That's why we can't work out a relationship based only our feeling. Love is a verb, an action. We can't make anyone love us, but we can always choose to love and forgive others. Our own attitude is all we can control.

I suppose, or at least some movies portray it, that some people just "click" and never have anything but good feelings. But in my own life and in the lives of everyone I know, love does not come so smoothly and we have to work at it. We have smooth parts and bumpy parts, and we are each part of that dance. I have my own baggage and life issues. I am so far from ideal or perfect. Personally I would not want everything to always be settled and mundane. I'm feisty and my mate is too. We are learning to not use that against each other, and we do have to go to the school of hard knocks every so often, due to our own choices. That's hard, but it's who we are. I don't want to be alone waiitng for mr. perfect when I am so far from being someone mr. perfect would want.

If we were all perfect love would always feel good, but we each have as you say, our stubborn areas, and our inner pain and insecurity that gives us some rather rough experiences. I honestly think that for you to face this situation and if you can get even more real, and more humble than you have ever been that you will have a breakthrough that will serve you well the rest of your life in all of your relationships no matter what happens with this lady friend...we can't predict what someone else will do, but we always have choices to make about ourselves.

Somone told my husband and I that if we hold onto being "right", we are wrong. That if we fight to win, we both lose. We can be "right" and alone even in a marriage, or we can choose to give up the right to be right and be together. We can choose to be real in what we feel and think, and not hold it against our mate. Wow that was a breakthrough for us. Just to understand that principle. It doesn't mean we both equally act on it at the same time. To be honest, my mate is most often the one to meet me where I am at, because I can't get out of myself as quickly as he. Often he just doesn't want to leave me alone as long as I need to shake my own bad feelings. I don't do that on purpose. I just have my own insecurities and hang ups. We both do...we choose to accept this in each other, and both of us own our own insecurity and don't blame the other one for it.

Out of my own insecurity I tend to want my space and to not be touched when I am upset. Out of his insecurity he tends to want hugs and kisses and closeness. So, how do you think that works out? How it works is we don't heap our expectations upon each other. We threw the expectations away and are learning who each other really is and to love the real person, not the image in our own minds. He knows I can't respond to his demands or fix what he feels...so he leaves me alone for awhile. Then he approaches to listen to whatever I want to say as long as it takes until he can see I have let down my guard, then he will ask if he can hug me. If I say no, he waits or leaves me alone until i go to him. Listen, I am not saying this is "right"...I am only saying we respect each others wounds...wounds we already had before we met each other. We are allowing each other psace to heal as we heal. We can't make it happen faster so the other never feels uncomfortable. I used to think it would have been better if we waited. Waited for what I don't know. I could not ask for a more loyal mate, and I am loyal to him.

By owning your emotions, what I mean is that when or if you are ready, you can tell your lady that you feel insecure. You can tell her "I am feeling insecure. It's my own problem , not yours and I was making it about you when it really is about me. You don't create what I feel, but I [U]am[/U] feeling that insecure and it's precenting me from going forward with you. I'm sorry that it hurts you. I don't mena it to but I know it does".

You can refrain from asking her to make you feel safe or better. You can tell her that you want her to have space to choose to respond or be indifferent or still angry over the conflict or whatever she feels, and that you don't balme her for what she feels....then leave her with it.

I think only after you approach her by owning your own emotional life and let her know that what you feel is about you and not against her, then she will see she has [U]freedom to respond[/U] to you...that does not mean that she will open up and be there for you. Maybe she is too injured, we can't know. All I know is that I am a very injured person, but when people leave me free to respond or not, almost always I will feel safe and reach out to them eventually.

I just tend to think both of your stubborness is more about past injury and not about lack of love for each other.





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