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Wow. If you want my 2 cents worth. After reading what both of you posted. And if I assume you both are saying the truth. Then this is how I see it. Please remember. I am not assuming either of them are not being truthful. I am going to just relfect off of what I have read.

To orangenecklace
I can see how you are feeling. I also see that the main part of the problems deal with the distant past. I also see that you did not simply tell him how you felt. It took him snooping into your things in order for him to know what goes on inside of you. From reading both of your parts. I do see he has gotten better. Definitely if he just let you walk away. And gave you no hassles. I also understand that it is not easy to just forgive someone for what they have done to you. Definitely by someone you are with for so long. I respect you for dealing with what you did deal with. But I also see partly that you are attatched to him somwhat. If he is an agoraphobic then I dont see why you would go over there so much if you just wanted him gone.

To derium
I can see how you would be upset. If she is telling you she wants to work on things. But behind your back she dates other men and tells strangers she wants to leave you but she will not tell that to you. I also see that you had and might still have some problems that you need to work on. I think that maybe you tryed to love her too much and expected too much from her. And in turn that made you act irrational and unloving. I give you respect for comforting her with the other man/men she dated. And for your understanding that she wanted to leave.

To you both
If you both ended on the terms you did I think it will be very hard on you both. Even if derium is mad about lies. And orangenecklace is mad about his temper. I still think after 2 years there is still small parts of comfort you both get from eachother. And most likly you will have to talk again because you both might have things that belong to eachother that you both want back. I feel a restraining order at this time might add just more baggage and unwanted stress. If derium does not let you do what you want. And he does start to show up at your work after you asking him not to be there. Then I would look into it. If he is physically abusive at you (99% of abused women will not ever openly admit they got abused) then get a restraining order now. You do not need to be hit by anyone.

My veiw
From the classes I have taken on psychology I think two clear things show. Derium you show classic signs of someone who lost a loved one and you are now afraid of it happening again. And by that you overreact to certain situations. And you feel sometimes if the person who claims to love you does not do cetain things You get worried that they do not care for you. And if they do not tell you they care you feel as if you are losing them already. And that scares you. But that is highly treatable.

And oragnenecklace
I do see you just plain sick of things. But I also see that you did stay with him for over a year when you were unhappy. And you also did go back to him after you were already away from him and dating other/another men/man. So if in fact he does not physically harm you. I see that you had some kinda of childhood/young adult trauma. something that might make you afraid of getting close to someone. Or you want to be close but you do not know how. So you will take the bads (no matter how big or small) and look at those only. Even if there is a reason the bad things happend. For example the sex that you both said when you slept. If you did once tell him that is what you like. Or you did use to be ok with him doing that. But now you almost hate him for it. If that is the case. Then that is also highly treatable.

My recomendation
derium if you do love her. And you do want her happy. You must be willing to do anything she askes for if she ever comes back into your life. Even as a friend you will need to realize that she is in your life because she does care for you. And realize that even if you never talk to her again. She did care for you. She took risks on you. And she did come back to you. So just hang in there. but do not put pressure on her. And stop doing anything she does not like as soon as you find out she does not like it. do not ever assume doing something like that is ok.

To orangenecklace
I recommend that you take some of this time to breath. If this is your only true break from eachother since you met. You will now have a chance to look at everything as a whole. If he is as understanding as he appeared to be. Then if you do want to talk to him just to come to terms or get closer (like after someone dies) even if it is tonight or a year from now. Then you have to make it clear why you are talking to him. If you decide to never talk to him again. Make sure you have all the closer and came to terms with everything that you need. Even if it is just to sit on a park bench and think. Or go to the gym and hit a punching bag for a while.

To you both
I am not telling you I am correct by anything I said. I am telling you from what I have read here. And what I have learned in classes. If in fact the both of you do think you have the problems I said. If you both have tryed to overcome this by yourselves. And it did not work It is time to go to someone professional. Either seperatly or together. I only say together because getting the closer and the final terms that you need is sometimes hard to do. And I have seen it help a lot of people. Many people who hated eachother but they went to counseling just so they woud learn from what happened. So they could prevent it ever happening with their next partner. Or to understand what they truly do want after all.

I do agree with derium. I think that lack of communication was a big issue with you both. If you did in fact tell him it was ok to do some of the stuff he did. And you both did come to a comprimise but that still caused problems. And you did tell him you wanted to work on things. Then that shows the number one problem with the both of you. I dont know if it was only one of you or both who had the problem (normaly one person will try to talk and one will refuse, normaly the guy will close up) but I do see that clearly a problem.

I will be more than happy to talk to either of you. I offer it to orangenecklace first. She took a step to get help and to find someone to confide in. And I am glad that she did. I think if she left with all of this anger it might get in the way of a future relationship. If I do talk to one of you. I will not talk to the other one. Unless both people agree to it. I will simply listen and talk you though this. And help you to heal.

[removed]

-Manny


[This message has been edited by Manny75 (edited 06-07-2003).]

[This message has been edited by Guardian (edited 06-07-2003).]





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