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Vaccination & Immunization Message Board

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I was in the same boat. I had vaccinated my son for the first go round, then around four months, I had this ovewhelming fear of something going wrong and couldn't pin it down. I did some serious soul searching and chose not to vaccinate him. I did so much research that it wasn't even funny....two weeks straight, glued to the internet, trying to decide. I didn't have this problem with my first, I was ignorrant to the problem, some days I almost wish that was still true, because the choice is hard, almost impossible at times.
You need to do what you feel is right, but either choice is scary. I have fears all the time that I didn't do what was right, yet have this gut feeling, the other option would have proved deadly for my son. I plan on doing his vaccinations when he turns two and the brain is more protected from the vaccination. You can also track the batch number that the vaccine comes out of, not sure of the place that does it, but you can get the batch number from your pediatrician and have it checked. It will tell you if that batch had more than average problems....some comfort, but not much.
From what I understand about thimerosol, it's dangerous because it's got a cumulative effect, and also has a range of (this is just an idea, not an actual figure, as I don't remember it) 1 to 10 parts per million, lets say your baby gets all the shots from a batch on the high end, the body stores it and hasn't had a chance to brake any of it down, and your child has a tendancy toward a certain illness or has an allergic type reaction....viola, vaccine reaction.
I do believe you should speak to your pediatrician as long as they are open minded. Mine was awesome. She is pro-vaccine, but is pro-mom as well. She helped me do much of my research, never pushed, gave me all the facts that she knew on her end, which did include death, autism, seizure, etc....but also told me what the opposite could be. They both have their risks, but need to be weighed carefully. You'll also carry the extra burden of having to make sure your child has a great, strong, immune system and keep them out of places that are high risk for these types of diseases. Most will make it out just fine, either way you choose, but it's in your child's best interest to keep the immune system strong.
There are very few herbs I advocate using for children because of proven safety... it doesn't mean they're not safe, but no one dares test them and those that have used them don't speak out because of fear of ridicule. It makes it tough. You should get a pediatric herb book, research it and if you have any doubts and don't find the answer you're looking for, bypass it...better safe than sorry. I use acidophylus (sp?) and beta-glucan for my baby, occasionally echinacea...but skip the golden seal because of possible safety issues. With my 9 yr old I use olive leaf and oil of oregano in a gel cap when he's getting sick. But you need to research proper doses and be dilligent in where you get your herbs, brand name, etc. to make sure they are at a standardized dose, meaning, a certain level is maintained and doesn't fluctuate much, some flucuate terribly.
You'll find your answer, just keep looking, talk to his doc, if they're no help, find one who is at least open to speaking to you about it, without putting you down and go from there. Just as a precaution, I try to keep my son out of high traffic areas during busy times and take anti-bacterial wipes with me everywhere......especially the grocery cart....chicken pox, cold, flu, rota-virus, fifths disease, etc....some sound scary, they aren't that bad, just miserable. Good luck to you, you are not a bad mom, you're a typical mom.
You never know true fear until you have children!!! Welcome to motherhood.
[QUOTE=mom_of_five]I think this is false " Andrew Wakefield, published in the journal Lancet that there is no link."

Do you have a link to Wakefield stating this? From what I have read, he stands by his studies and conclusions, it is however his co-authors who have backpedaled due to fear of blackballing (as they witnessed what happened to Wakefield) and therefore reacanted.[/QUOTE]

Yep - you are correct (and I was wrong). It wasn't Wakefield but one of his co-authors from the original article

Murch S. Separating inflammation from speculation in autism. Lancet 2003;362:1498-9

He still stands by his claim that IBD (or associated GI related diseases) plays a part in causing autism. However, Dr. Murch no longer believes that MMR plays a role in autism.

In reference to malpractice:

Do I recommend MMR for fear of malpractice? NO. I recommend MMR because I believe it is the best thing for the kids (except for kids with immunodeficiency such as SCIDS or AIDS). Giving MMR is still the standard of care and if I were to recommend not getting the MMR (and the child later gets an infection), I am liable.

As for why I might get sued for malpractice if the parent chooses not to vaccinate (and the child gets meningitis from Hemophilus influenza or any other diseases prevented by vaccination). Remember, we live in a very lawsuit-happy society and unfortunately, in a society where a lot of people do not take responsibility for their actions.

If a child gets extremely sick or dies, a lawyer might convince the family to sue. Whether or not their lawsuit is successful (the fact that the parents asked not to be vaccinated is a factor for the jury to decide), I still have to pay for lawyers and also time away from work (for deposition, court, etc). It also has a psychological impact (stress, wondering if I did the right thing, what would happen if I lost the case, etc).

Do I know of a case where this happened? NO (fortunately). But it could happen and i've seen juries award money for more benign things.

Anyway, disclaimer. My posts in this thread for the most part represent my belief. Questions and concerns about vaccination (risk, benefits, etc) should be referred to your physician who knows you, and knows your medical and social history (since everyone is unique). Never trust information posted by anonymous posters on internet boards (so therefore, take what I posted with a grain of salt)

OK ... it's been a long day and I'm tired ... and since I'm responsible for taking this thread on a tangent, I'll probably stop posting in this thread (probably). To the original poster, I do apologize for the tangent.
Imagine that, I forgot a few things. One thing I forgot was the feeling that we as parents are often dismissed when we are concerned about a reaction. The docs may just brush us off and say it's normal or it's not in any way related to the vaccine. This is one thing that concerns me. I dont' feel that it's a well thought response. It makes me wonder how many vaccine reactions there may be, but how many are dismissed? Not that they're completely avoidable, but in my mind, if they really paid attention to them and tracked them, they may find a corralation, previously unknown and would allow for them to make adjustments to head off future reactions.

Many times I've heard, that's normal. What is not understood, is it may be normal in many ways, but not normal for my child. I've encountered that with docs of all specialties. I know that in my experience w/ dog/wolf rescue I can remove myself emotionally from the situation where I have to tell someone they have to euthanize their animal because it's a threat/danger. They are in tears and I'm sitting there thinking..."Don't they know what this animal could do to their child's face??? Is it worth it???" Much like many med pros see it all the time and sometimes, it is forgotten that we are people with feelings, fears, etc. We didn't have the same training, nor the same everyday life experiences that you do, to draw strenght, faith, conclusions, whatever from. We are like the idiots with the rabid dog, thinking with our emotions because we don't have the knowledge to think otherwise. Therefore, that leaves it to emotion.

Also, have you seen or are you aware of a study where they focus on the whole circle? It seems to me (as we all know, not what it probably is in real terms) that most of the focus is on the positive and we are treated like, "It's got more positive than negative, so don't worry. We don't" To a layman, that sounds like they just want to stick their heads in the sand. The studies that I've read seem to focus almost solely on what they want to convey and only glean over the other aspects of it. Is there an honestly, subjective study that would give all the answers, whether or not they are what anyone wants to know? Another thing that would be helpful is actual numbers, not just percentages that don't mean much to those not in the know. I never thought about it until you brought it up....your way of putting the calculated risks. The numbers don't tell the whole story. I don't know exactly how you put it, but showed how the small number of non-vaccinated getting sick is actually higher percentage wise because of the amount of numbers vaccinated. It's not put in understandable terms. We need to be able to ask the questions that we don't understand.

I won't pretend to understand all the medical jargon, but I grasp enough to know I need to keep asking questions....the hard part is finding someone who understands it that will explain it in a way I understand and keeping it neutral. Just explaining the facts, not their personal feelings behind it. I just want to know what it all means, that's all.
First off i want to say My heart goes out to all of you for the pain and experiences you have suffered and endured. I am not a mom and do not plan to be in the NEAR future but I have a LOT of younger siblings and five of the nine of us have had SEVERE reactions to shots (myself included) My 1 5 year old brother has been diagnosed with Asperger Syndrome this is a form of autism.... They did tests on him and his family (he is a step brother to me) to see if they could find the gene in anyone in his family and found it only in his brothers (2 of them all though they are not as joticeable or strong). They finally came back and asked my mom when he started acting this way (he does and says peculiar things if anyone is aware of this disability you know what I am talking about) well she said she noticed when he was two.... but he had always been different as a baby and kind of in his own world. The doctors then told her that this was a side effect from his shots. The reason he is showing more is because she stopped getting the other two's shots when after their two years but she was a new mom who thought she should conform to the norm.

Next scenario is my baby sister. She got her 2 months shots. Three days later she was blind in one eye.

Me: When I was younger I used to get very sick and groggy from the shots normal yes but not to the point where I was constantly sleeping for days afterwards and my body would shake. The doctors told my mom she was panicking and to leave me alone I would be fine. Well When it became a staedfast law in the state I was going to school in I had to get my shots I did and had a seizure and stopped breathing and spent a week in the ICU.

My yonger brother had a similiar experience except he was born in a time when they were starting to recognize that shots were causing side effects. HE stopped breathing and had a seizure after receiving his 2 month shots.... They found out he was allergic to the "T" part in the DPT shots (tussis or something like that!)

Last of all was my teenage brother who like me they thought my mom was overreacting... when he got his shots he just laid in his crib qand stared at the ceiling he didnt move or anything for three days.... later he was diagnosed with a kind of diability that is liek brain damage excep the leads a mostly normal life unless it comes to school stuff and remembering short term and learning neew things. Things that would take a day for most people to learn it takes him a week. Also whatever it was that affected is also slowly eating away at his brain. They said he would be dead before he ever saw his thirtieth birthday. It seems liek every day it is getting harder and harder for him to live that normal life....

Okay so now thta you have heard the AWFUL effects that shots can have on a person let me tell you the good they can do.

As an EMT you have to be tuberculosis and Hepatitis vaccinated. Well I was, but my partner wasnt and one day I went on a call for a guy who ended up throwing up all over me and my partner. Well come to find out he had hepatitis. We got the tests and our first round of shots.... I came out clean. My partner is now living a life of agony of haveing hepatitis. She had to quit the field and her fiance left her out of fear.

Lastly My dad went to work on a patient who when they arrived at the hospital was diagnosed with tuberculosis. If my dad had not been vaccinated he would have contracted that VERY deadly disease.

So my view is liek BREN its up to you to decide some states require for your children to go into public schools that they be vaccinated. So check out your laws, but mostly go with your heart

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